Thursday, August 22, 2019

Review: Pathfinder 2nd Edition


When this was originally announced I was excited for it as I had a lot of good experiences playing the first edition of pathfinder and into the playtest because if they were really doing a true second edition I wanted to be involved in changing a lot of the bloat, fiddly nuts and bolts, and getting rid of the over complication that is inherit in the d20 3.x systems. Due to life circumstances I had to back away from the play test in its infancy but I still followed it on forums and what have you. After seeing people viciously argue over various points on social media I took a step back and forgot about it until my pre-order showed up on my door.


Presentation: This is a hardback bullet stopping tome of 638 color pages is crammed with charts, tables, and the classic vibrant Pathfinder art style. Regardless of the page count the book is really well played out and organized. There is a table of contents and a combined glossary and index which I have never seen done before and I think it is a great idea. In addition, they took a design note from their 1e Equipment Guide and each page has a section toolbar showing you what section you are in and it makes flipping through the book a breeze. I am very impressed with the level of organization and the ease it creates when tracking down specific information.


Character Creation: This has been completely overhauled and I think is an enjoyable process in which your character feels more alive instead of just a random collection of numbers. I will walk you through the steps:

1. Create a Concept 

2. Start Building Ability Scores*: The six ability scores all start out at 10 and as you move through character creation (choosing your Ancestry, Background, and Class) you get Ability Boosts (which increase a specific ability by 2) and Ablity Flaws (which decrease a specific ability by 2). There see instances of free choices and at the end of the day, you end up with a set of Abilities between the ranges of 8-18. 

*This solves a lot of the swingyness of rolling for Ablities and makes more sense thematically when adding the character creation process together.

3. Select an Ancestry*: This is the classic choosing a race and record the stats etc. Your options are Dwarf, Elf, Gnome, Goblin, Halfling, Human, Half Elf, and Half Orc. Each race has sub "bloodlines" to choose from and racial feats.


* I am happy and impressed that they decided to include the Goblin as a "core" race. I think Pathfinder Goblins are rad on multiple levels.

4. Pick a Background: Each background has a little blurb and things to add to your character. The choices are Acoyte, Acrobat, Aninal Whisperer, Artisian, Artist, Barkeep, Barrister, Bounty Hunter, Charlatan, Criminal, Detective, Emissary, Entertainer, Farmhand, Field Medic, Fortune Teller, Gambler, Gladiator, Guard, Herbalist, Hermit, Hunter, Laborer, Martial Discipline, Merchant, Miner, Noble, Nomad, Prisoner, Sailor, Scholar, Scout, Street Urchin, Tinker, and Warrior.

5. Choose a Class*: Pretty self explanatory. The choices are Alchemist, Barbarian, Bard, Champion, Cleric, Druid, Fighter, Monk, Ranger, Rogue, Sorcerer, and Wizard. Each class has class specific feats. 


*It is great that they included the Alchemist as a "core" class and they also renamed the Paladin the Champion. The Champion can now be Lawful Good, Neutral Good, and Chaotic Good. I am glad they renamed the Paladin but it bugs me to no end that they are still afflicted by The Plague of 9 Alignments - why cant it be a Champion of whatever cause/God you want? Ugh...

6. Determine Ability Scores: Add everything up to get your totals and record the totals and their related ability modifiers. 

7. Record Class Details: Put the pieces together. 

8. Buy Equipment*: At 1st level your character gets 15 gold pieces to buy gear.

*The math has been cleaned up here and the prices and everything gold related have been reduced for easier tracking and house keeping which I think is a good call.

Resolution System: It uses the d20 system found on all 3.x style games which breaks down to most rolls being d20 + Modifiers -penalties vs. Target Number. There are damage rolls that include using different polyhedral dice + bonuses - penalties. Common rolls found in Pathfinder 2nd Edition are:

Melee Attack Roll: d20 + Strength Modifier (or optional Dexterity Modifier for a finesse weapon) + Proficiency Bonus + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Ranged Attack Roll: d20 + Dexterity Modifier + Proficiency Bonus + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Spell Attack Roll: d20 + Ability Modifier used for Spellcasting + Proficiency Bonus + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Perception Check: d20 + Wisdom Modifier + Proficiency Bonus + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Fortitude Save: d20 + Constitution Modifier + Proficiency Bonus + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Reflex Save: d20 + Dexterity Modifier + Proficiency Bonus + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Will Save: d20 + Wisdom Modifier + Proficiency Bonus + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Skill Check: d20 + Modifier of the Skills Key Ability Score + Proficiency Bonus + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Melee Damage: damage die of weapon/unarmed attack + Strength Modifier + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Ranged Damage: damage die of weapon/unarmed attack + Strength Modifier for Thrown Weapons + Other Bonuses - Penalties.

Spell Damage (and similar effects): damage die of effect + Other Bonuses - Penalties.


Crunch: I could write a dissertation paper on all the crunch but instead I'll note the core differences from Pathfinder 1e. 
  • Character creation has been overhauled and there is a different system for determining Ability Scores. This has been discussed above.
  • There is a three action economy and you spend those three action points anyway you want. Certain actions cost more and their are classes they have unique things they can do with their action points. You also get a one reaction per encounter turn and an unlimited number of free actions. 

  • Math has been tightened up considerably across the board. Bonuses to attacks, saves, and defenses are calculated based on level of proficiency (2/4/6/8 + level) and there is very little that modifies this. The gold, spells, and the experience/leveling system have all been scaled down.
  • There are now four degrees of succes. Critical failure (achieving a die result of 10 and under the target number), failure, success, and critical success (achieving a die result of 10 or more above the target number). 
  • Ancestries and Classes are now modular by way of making everything a feat. There are Ancestry Feats, Class Feats, and General Feats. Even proficiencies are feats. You start with a certain number of feats per the character creation process and each level you get a feat in one category or another.
  • Multi-Classing is done via taking another classes feat chain instead of your chosen class. 
  • Everyone can multi-attack via the three point action economy. The second attack I'd done at a -5 and the third attack is at a -10. There are some abilities that modify this. 
  • The new monster design has made the monsters more interesting and fun to use. Each monster had their own unique actions they can employ like the Sketon being able to take of its head and throw it. 

Final Thoughts: I feel like the game as a whole is a huge improvement over Pathfinder 1e. Some of the best and most positive changes are character creation, the action economy, streamlining the math (especially the proficiency system), and the degrees of success. 

An interesting thing to note is the design philosophy behind the proficiency system. As stated before it sits at a +2/4/6/8 (depending on your level of training in said proficiency) + level. This makes encounter building and challenge degree of said encounter different because monsters use the same proficiency system and coupled with the degrees of success makes it very dynamic. This also goes as far as putting monsters on a more even playing field as a 20th level character still had a good chance of getting hit by monsters. A finally cool thing this does is making unarmored characters more viable as armor class is calculated by proficiency bonus + armor bonus + shield bonus + other modifiers (obviously armored characters are going to have a better armor class but this really puts unarmored characters on a more even playing field). 

With that being said, I am disappointed that Paizo really missed the mark becuase it did not go far enough in streamlining and creating the second edition. To me it feel like Pathfinder 1.75 instead of 2.0. It is still a tactical focused (minis and map) , heavy prep, lots of things to track (conditions, ranges, etc.), and rule for everything game. I would play it but I would never run it.


You can find it at your local gaming store, Barnes and NobleAmazon, and Paizo.

Don't forget the character sheets.


3 comments:

  1. Do you think this system suffers a bit from Target Number Creep at higher levels, due to Trained or higher rolls including a 'your level' modifier?

    Like, does monster AC drift up to the mid-20's around player level 10 to compensate for it? Do target numbers shift?

    ReplyDelete
  2. There is no real target number creep that I have noticed.

    The biggest effect this has is that monsters have better chances hitting high level heavily armored characters instead of combat becoming whiff machine.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Only aspire to mention ones content can be as incredible. This clarity with your post is superb and that i may think you’re a guru for this issue. High-quality along with your concur permit me to to seize your current give to keep modified by using approaching blog post. Thanks a lot hundreds of along with you should go on the pleasurable get the job done. Copper Dice

    ReplyDelete